Time to Revamp MFM Maps Downloads?

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aikliang
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Time to Revamp MFM Maps Downloads?

Postby aikliang » Thu May 20, 2010 1:25 pm

Dear Bros & Sisters at MFM, let me play the Devil Advocate here. This topic not meant to criticize or step on anybody toes but to have a constructive discussion on solutions at alleviating the problems of bandwidth for map downloading (and also :$gone: for Bros Shawchyn and Chaicka)

First of all, a big thanks to Bros Shawchyn and Chaicka for hosting the maps on their servers. Also thanks to other bros who have helped to up-load the maps to other site for down-loading.

As you are aware, we had encountered problems with the down-loading of maps i.e. slowwwwwwwww. This was caused by an exceptional traffic to both the main servers. According to Shawchyn, on the 1st day itself, traffic was nearly 38GB, 2nd day nearly 14GB for 9 hours. He estimated to cater to all MFM members, need 1TB of bandwidth, which Bro chaicka concur.

The question to be asked is why such as demand. MFM 100517 is only about 55MB or 0.055GB. This means about 370 people are downloading the maps. But if you look at my analysis of active members with more than 100 posts, it is only 229 members. MFM has about 23,123 members out of which a whooping 18,886 do not have any posts!!!!

For discussion:_

1. Should we limit Shawchyn and chaicka server to only invited members/users only? After all, these 229 members are actively contributing to MFM on tracks, way-points, helping other members, etc. Shouldn't they get the fruits of their labour?

2. Should we reduce the frequency of the up-dates from weekly to maybe once a month? Maps are release weekly for mappers and contributors to check and are usually do have problems. Do we need to release these maps to the public when they are more for the mappers, etc?

3. Can we point other people (users) to other download sites such as rapidshare, etc?

4. Can we get the navigation devices manufacturers or software companies like GARMIN, PAPAGO to host the maps since they have more interest in this? (This question may cause some members to get agitated or annoyed but please bear in mind, this is meant as constructive argument)?

Appreciate your comments or suggestions so that our moderators, site admin and others can make the necessary decisions for the benefits of all members.
It is not the mountain that we conquer but ourselves - Edmund Hilary

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keanhoe
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Re: Time to Revamp MFM Maps Downloads?

Postby keanhoe » Thu May 20, 2010 2:14 pm

Just my opinion. I think how many posts a member has should not be a criteria for download priority or anything. Otherwise, we will have members posting non relevant posts, just to get their post count up.

Like I said, just my opinion and it does not address your suggestions above.
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drsec
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Re: Time to Revamp MFM Maps Downloads?

Postby drsec » Thu May 20, 2010 4:27 pm

I dont have an issue with the congestion because I have gotten over the "update fetish" or "download addiction".

I dont use my GPS everyday. It is not as if I miss an update release by a few days or even skip an update release completely, is going to seriously cause me to get lost for my daily commute between house and office.

I dont mind waiting for the congestion to die down to get an update. I have even skipped updates. I start my download when I go to bed and it is usually completed when I wake up.

Congestion is caused by too many users accessing the site/downloading the data at any one given time. This is the cause of the slowness. The length of the slow period is dependent on the file size and the bandwidth subscribed. If the files are small and the bandwidth is big, then the length of time spent on the site is shorter and thus a greater numbers of Users can be served at a one given time period. The easiest way to overcome this is for the Users to be patient.

Internet hosting companies has several charging schemes. Some charge by bandwidth size with unlimited volume of downloads. Most charge a fixed bandwidth with also a fixed download volume in a given time block. When you exceed the download limit, they will allow you to momentarily exceed it. But if you exceed it repeatedly, then they choke you off or even shut you down until the next time block. The time block is usually a month. If you exceed your download limit for 3 consecutive months, then you will be forced to pay for a higher scheme. I should know, I used to provide internet hosting. One of my forums went thru the same fate. They switched hosts and then finally switched off the online chat.

I fear it is the download volume limit what we will hit. This is the bigger worry, not the congestion.

Given the number of members and the file size, the total download volume in one month exceed the subscribed bandwidth.

The easiest way to overcome the threat of being cut off, is to reduce the frequency of update releases in a given month. The other is to buy a bigger bandwidth or get more mirror sites.

As for me, I would support reducing the update release frequency and get more mirror sites.

FrancisTLim
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Re: Time to Revamp MFM Maps Downloads?

Postby FrancisTLim » Thu May 20, 2010 5:29 pm

aikliang wrote:As you are aware, we had encountered problems with the down-loading of maps i.e. slowwwwwwwww. This was caused by an exceptional traffic to both the main servers. According to Shawchyn, on the 1st day itself, traffic was nearly 38GB, 2nd day nearly 14GB for 9 hours. He estimated to cater to all MFM members, need 1TB of bandwidth, which Bro chaicka concur.

I think that this is Map update, and not Antivirus update. So even if we download the latest map 6 days late (ie. on the eve of a new map release), it should not matter that much. So, my suggestion is to simply limit the bandwidth of those servers. If on a give day/hour, the bandwidth is used up, then so be it. The user can try again on another day/hour. I think what we should consider is the bandwidth requirement spread out over the entire week.

Just my opinion. Maybe some of you have more facts to back up some other calculation model.
Regards,
FrancisTLim.

chinwy
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Re: Time to Revamp MFM Maps Downloads?

Postby chinwy » Thu May 20, 2010 6:19 pm

My opinion:

Total no of postings is not reflective of the work done by anyone - some of us prefer to contribute in silance. An NO vote from me.

Bandwidth - I know that timing of download is the issue. I am 4 - 5 hours ahead of Malaysia and I do not face the slowwwness.

Frequency of maps release. Only one question. Are we backtracking on what we set out? A change of guards?

Putting the issues to a vote? I sense a deja vu... 3 years ago.

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aikliang
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Re: Time to Revamp MFM Maps Downloads?

Postby aikliang » Thu May 20, 2010 10:00 pm

keanhoe wrote:Just my opinion. I think how many posts a member has should not be a criteria for download priority or anything. Otherwise, we will have members posting non relevant posts, just to get their post count up.

Like I said, just my opinion and it does not address your suggestions above.
If I am not mistaken, not all posts that you have posted is counted towards your total number of posts (Moderators, senior members, please correct this if I am wrong). So even if you spam, your posts count do not go up and you might just end up being ban from MFM.
chinwy wrote:My opinion:

Total no of postings is not reflective of the work done by anyone - some of us prefer to contribute in silance. An NO vote from me.

Bandwidth - I know that timing of download is the issue. I am 4 - 5 hours ahead of Malaysia and I do not face the slowwwness.

Frequency of maps release. Only one question. Are we backtracking on what we set out? A change of guards?

Putting the issues to a vote? I sense a deja vu... 3 years ago.
I agree with bro chinwy on the total no of postings. It is not the quantity that counts but the quality of the posts. I have noticed that there are some members although with only one post are "Valued Contributors". That's why I am suggesting, the usage of the main servers are for "invited or valued" members only. The rest can download from the mirrors.

Frequency of map release? My suggestion here is do we really need to download the new map every week? How often do you really use your PND? I rarely use mine, sometimes not even at all for two whole weeks and I am still using the February 2010 map on my GMXT. I just downloaded the 100514 map about 3 days ago to check on the way-points and track-logs that I have submitted. I have also downloaded some maps between Feb and 3 days ago but have never use them.

This is not about putting the issue to a vote but to have a constructive discussion and come out with suggestions for site admin, moderators, mappers, etc. for them to consider and implement. After all, more heads are better than one and someone might just come out with a brilliant idea...
It is not the mountain that we conquer but ourselves - Edmund Hilary

myserf
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Re: Time to Revamp MFM Maps Downloads?

Postby myserf » Thu May 20, 2010 11:27 pm

Hi to everyone,

Just my 2 sen that it is quite exceptional to have a weekly update of the map. A monthly, two months once or even a quarterly map update would enable the bandwidth to be managed properly. Remember, waste not, want not... :thumbsup:

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sandmanz
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Re: Time to Revamp MFM Maps Downloads?

Postby sandmanz » Thu May 20, 2010 11:54 pm

What is the difference between weekly map update and 2 weekly map update in term of slow download process? Is it the dowbnload volume? I would thought that if it were monthly update, the problem could actually get worst (is it?) due to people anticipating and want to get the latest map, instead of for weekly, not that many people actually care to download because they know that if they miss this week, next week is stil just around the corner.

Another thing.. if the weekly map updates are said to be for mappers only, is it possible to make a file patch download which will install the latest updates / corrections to the existing map?.. ie patch file will be significantly smaller in size.

:rox: :tq: :good:
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shawchyn
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Re: Time to Revamp MFM Maps Downloads?

Postby shawchyn » Fri May 21, 2010 12:20 am

sandmanz wrote:What is the difference between weekly map update and 2 weekly map update in term of slow download process? Is it the dowbnload volume? I would thought that if it were monthly update, the problem could actually get worst (is it?) due to people anticipating and want to get the latest map, instead of for weekly, not that many people actually care to download because they know that if they miss this week, next week is stil just around the corner.


I totally agreed with bro sandmanz, if reduce the frequency of updates, it will sure make the map release day worst. The problems that we are facing now is basically as follow:

    1. We have > 23K registed users, 10% of them download the file mean 2300 downloads and is about 134Gb of data downloaded
    2. We do not have ENOUGH servers to distribute the download sequence. So, existingly MY server seem to be served for all the users
    3. Many users doesn't like to download from other "Share Files" service provider, ie RAPIDSHARE

I have ask my programmer to working on a solutions to detect the user IP and route it to their nearest download server. My ideas is to provide "automatic" push the users to use the correct server to download the maps. For example: If the user is identified from Malaysia, he/she will NOT able to download from bro chaicka's server located in SG. Same thing applied to SG user, priority server in MY will serve MY users.

And others countries users will redirect to Share File site for download for the first 4 days of the maps release, the slot for download from MY server will only availabe at the later time of the week. I think it is more fair to MY users.

Again, if any of you guys have better ideas/sugguestion, it is welcome for discussion. =P~
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cwyap
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Re: Time to Revamp MFM Maps Downloads?

Postby cwyap » Fri May 21, 2010 7:14 am

My proposals:-

a) main download servers for selected few (those who can dedicate the time to download and then re-upload to free file sharing servers) - links to be provided to the selected few via PM;

b) selected parties to re-upload within an agreed time frame the updates to the freebies servers; and

c) once uploaded, selected parties to place the URLs in the regular update thread.

As for those who don't like downloading from free file sharing servers, well... time to be realistic - LIVE WITH IT. MFM is a free map community but that doesn't mean we have to be so "kiasu" as to demand everything that fancies our whims & desires; this is particularly true for those who continuously download and demand for more while not contributing anything in return.
Courage is not living without fear.
Courage is being scared to death and doing the right thing anyway.
- Chae Richardson


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